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spot on
Joined: 15 Jun 2015
Posts: 373
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 Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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Don’t know why the club just don’t say 😡
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TxRover
Joined: 02 Jun 2018
Posts: 3503
Location: North Texas, USA
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| Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2019 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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| spot on wrote: | | Don’t know why the club just don’t say 😡 |
Because Rule J21 of the SFA specifically gives the SFA Board the sole right to determine what publicity, if any, is given to any decision. The club would be exposed to sanction if they violated said rule. |
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spot on
Joined: 15 Jun 2015
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| Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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It hasn’t been stated that this is the case that I’m aware of but if it had why don’t Raith confirm this!
It will eventually be show in Rovers accounts so they can’t stop it
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Vinnie
Joined: 12 Jul 2008
Posts: 8219
Location: None Of Your Business
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| Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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Yep
Easy,club just state that they are not a liberty to reveal outcome of tribunal much like the undisclosed fees we get fed when theirs a transfer involved
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red zebra
Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 2597
Location: Whaur the bridies are
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| Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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| TxRover wrote: | | spot on wrote: | | Don’t know why the club just don’t say 😡 |
Because Rule J21 of the SFA specifically gives the SFA Board the sole right to determine what publicity, if any, is given to any decision. The club would be exposed to sanction if they violated said rule. |
I think the J21 you refer to Tx is actually an SPFL rule and my understanding is, that it deals with publicity regarding a club and it's players contracts not transfers (or Panel decisions). The transfer tribunal is different and covered in section F of the rules (F9 onwards) but I could find no mention of disclosure. You have to go to section K to read about Director/Staff confidentialitiy and it is suitably fuzzy to be a cover all bases kind of thing.
Having said that, read section F, we should already had 50% of highest offer made payment from the Pars and the balance will be due within 14 days of the panels decision plus interest at the BoE base rate +2%, unless of course an appeal is lodged.
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Last edited by red zebra on Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:52 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Franco
Joined: 10 Oct 2019
Posts: 1195
Location: kirkcaldy
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| Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting to know,guys, but why are supporters having to delve into Scottish Football Rules on this topic?
If memory serves ,both Bill Clark and John Sim have talked about transparency and openness in the past and,certainly, supporters are encouraged to give financial support to the Club.
So they should either release the information or provide the reason(s)
why they won't/can't do so.
Personally, I don't think that there was a happy ending,in terms of funds received/to be received but,at least,we can then move on. |
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StarksBarmy
Joined: 03 Apr 2010
Posts: 4021
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| Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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Shame we don’t have someone in role of supporter director who comes on here regularly that could maybe clarify things, even if it was to tell us that the club can’t come out directly and say at this moment...
We do you say?  |
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red zebra
Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 2597
Location: Whaur the bridies are
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| Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Franco wrote: | Interesting to know,guys, but why are supporters having to delve into Scottish Football Rules on this topic?
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It's not so much the delving into the rules but they way they are written. Speaking as a layman (I have no legal training) many of the laws are open to interpretation (which is the biggest issue) and can therefore have outcomes changed depending on the views of the particular panel that sits. Or you may get the usual bunch of lazy sods who think they will just do what they did last time, irrespective of the clubs involved, because 'that worked' rather than a case by case basis.
I have no faith in those that govern the game and part of that is because I have no faith in the laws they impose. Whilst I appreciate there must be consideration given in individual cases, there absolutely need to be more clarity in the laws.
As for Mr Clark, Mr Sim and the Supporters Director (whoever he is), I guess you would need to write to them and ask the question.
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TxRover
Joined: 02 Jun 2018
Posts: 3503
Location: North Texas, USA
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| Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:57 am Post subject: |
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OK, downloaded the whole *beep* 2019-2020 Handbook. Section 99 is the ruling article. The Tribunial is, by defintion, an arbitration panel, and subject as such to Scottish Law. That places it under Arbitration (Scotland) Act 2010. That leads to:
"Arbitration in Scotland is a confidential process, and unlike the position in most jurisdictions, the duty to treat proceedings as confidential is backed up by legislation. The obligation to treat all matters relating to the arbitration confidentially is enshrined in the Scottish Act, and is has been strongly backed by the Scottish courts."
Since the SFA Handbook speciaifally enjoins the parties from appealing to the Courts, this is the ruling statement, and the result is confidential, as a matter of law...in my opinion, your mileage may vary, don't use externally, not for consumption, do not remove tag under penalty of law. |
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scotty
Joined: 12 Jul 2008
Posts: 9065
Location: Almost Dysart.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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| StarksBarmy wrote: | Shame we don’t have someone in role of supporter director who comes on here regularly that could maybe clarify things, even if it was to tell us that the club can’t come out directly and say at this moment...
We do you say? |
I'd guess that kind of info would only be offered if asked for (and possibly not even then), it's not the kind of details most clubs offer wholesale as they don't want potential creditors/other clubs knowing that they have some money and more importantly how much they have as that could influence deals done for any incoming players.
From the main site:
Meet the Directors
Raith Rovers benefits from a highly experienced board.Here’s an insight into their involvement with the club and their lives beyond the Rovers.Note: Board members are happy to discuss any concerns or ideas supporters have about the running of the club, and can be contacted via the main office.
Main office is a hyperlink to contact details but that doesn't include a general email address. Going by Bob, Lynne and Lauras email addresses I'd guess all the directors email addresses are just their individual forename.surname@raithrovers.net so if you have a question it might be worth pinging in an email to the director you want an answer from. All the directors and their roles within the club are sub listed under Directors under People on the main site.
Raith directors past and present have always said to me that they are happy to openly discuss most aspects of the club that does not include financial aspects such as players wages or contracts. Worth noting that in the past quite often the buying club has stipulated that the fee remained undisclosed which is probably why we couldn't say we got £50,000 from Hearts for Callachan.
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Neil M
Joined: 16 Aug 2008
Posts: 2589
Location: Aberdeen
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| Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 6:54 pm Post subject: |
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That is a fair point Scotty. There are always two sides to a story and things are never quite what we assume them to be. The assumption is that the club do not disclose fees because they think we would all freak out, but maybe, as said, there could be disclosure issues there with the SPFL or the fee could actually be higher than the asking price - provided that the club kept it confidential.
For me, the Rovers Board are generally a good one - and fellow Rovers fans. The club is friendly and they do try to keep their connections with fans. Not all clubs have that. For slippery lies and condescending indifference, see the SFA and their attitude to the Tartan Army and our national team! |
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red zebra
Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 2597
Location: Whaur the bridies are
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| Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Neil M wrote: | That is a fair point Scotty. There are always two sides to a story and things are never quite what we assume them to be. The assumption is that the club do not disclose fees because they think we would all freak out, but maybe, as said, there could be disclosure issues there with the SPFL or the fee could actually be higher than the asking price - provided that the club kept it confidential.
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Totally accept that however, if the club has had the judgement passed down by the tribunal, it would just be nice to know that an agreement has been reached, I guess it's not our business to be informed of finer details of the finances of the club as that is commercially sensitive information, but the club could have issued a statement saying the matter was concluded, assuming of course, that it has been, this is the Pars we are dealing with.
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scotty
Joined: 12 Jul 2008
Posts: 9065
Location: Almost Dysart.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Neil M wrote: | That is a fair point Scotty. There are always two sides to a story and things are never quite what we assume them to be. The assumption is that the club do not disclose fees because they think we would all freak out, but maybe, as said, there could be disclosure issues there with the SPFL or the fee could actually be higher than the asking price - provided that the club kept it confidential.
For me, the Rovers Board are generally a good one - and fellow Rovers fans. The club is friendly and they do try to keep their connections with fans. Not all clubs have that. For slippery lies and condescending indifference, see the SFA and their attitude to the Tartan Army and our national team! |
True Neil, it is a good board on the whole and some folks don't seem to appreciate that. What I've generally found is that they are available, just nip into SP on any given day (non match days) you'll probably see the likes of Bill Clark, Tom Morgan or Andy Mill in the office. These guys give up an awful lot of their own time to keep the club running as smoothly as possible. I've known Andy Mill for over 20 years and since he was elected to the board I've noticed he has spent an incredible amount of time doing stuff for the club on a day to day basis. I've heard the moans from a few that he is never available on a match day but that's not exactly true. Most home games he is in SP from 11.30 until after 7pm at night. Between 11-30 and 2pm he'll be in the 200 club or other lounges speaking to sponsors. At 2pm he and the rest of the directors meet and greet the visiting directors and if the visitors have a fans rep then it'll be Mr Mill the want to talk to. After the game once the visitors have been talked to you'l almost always find him in the 200 Club. IMO it's a bit unfair for some fans to claim he or any of the directors are inaccessible just because they aren't standing waiting on them when they come through the turnstile 10 mins before kick off.
I emailed the office some years ago regarding a concern I had at the time and received a very satisfactory reply from Turnbull Hutton, all of which proves that if you seek them out they will reply (except as we said for the listed reasons above) but only if they can.
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embow
Moderator
Joined: 05 Jul 2008
Posts: 13020
Location: Lybster: O'er 'e Ord and far frae Fife
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| Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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We have currently a very good Board, staff and volunteers at all levels.
As pointed out, very hard working folk who are dedicated to doing the very best for our club.
Some matters must always remain private within the club, as in all walks of life.
I say this with having over fifty years experience of boardroom comings and goings at the club.
It could be an awful lot worse, believe you me.
You just need to read about some of the unrest at Falkirk in recent months and also think back to some of the past roasters/chancers we've had over time.
Being a director of a small provincial football club is never easy.
You're damned if you do and damned if you don't in the eyes of many fans.
If all is reasonably well on the pitch, and off it, then it's easier but if things are not, then the unrest starts and everyone thinks they know best.
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Franco
Joined: 10 Oct 2019
Posts: 1195
Location: kirkcaldy
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| Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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Ok Neil and you subsequent contributors, I,for one, see the other side of the argument re disclosure in business.
.....and the current owner and Board seem like ''good guys'' unlike eg a past one from a time back who seemed to act as a ''wise guy''with his two ''heavy'' companions (who never seemed to watch the games  ) -or was that just my overactive imagination? [and,NO,I don't mean Gordon Brown  ]
I guess it just irked me that a guy who scores goals for fun turned out to have a release clause in his contract and is excelling for the Pars (who couldn't buy a goal last season).
Its the season of goodwill, so I urge everyone to accept that the Club have their reasons for silence on this- to move on!
And,of course, We've got McGlynn,Super John McGlynn! |
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